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There was a big twitter discussion about Latin pronunciation today, to use macrons or not to use macrons, whether to teach pronunciation to students or let them pick it up by listening to you and other input (trusting the quality you provide), etc. I felt the discussion beginning to spiral in its usual fashion of pros and cons. Back when the Latinteach list was active, this discussion came up numerous times. And often if I replied, I also posted a copy of my reply on this blog. I just read through them, and in some I was quite passionate--one, even a bit out of line. If you would like to read those older posts just click on the PRONUNCIATION tag in the right margin.

So in many ways, there's no need for me to repeat what I've said before, except for the fact that we have a couple more issues now that we didn't really have then. First, there are a LOT of people (well, a room full of 50 at ACL--that's 1/6 of the participents) who are interested in trying to use more techniques to make their class a Comprehensible Input classroom. That requires a LOT of oral work. It is the idea that you can get in more repetitions and in a more engaging and compelling way orally. Yes, reading still plays a strong role but there is a LOT of emphasis on the oral part.

Second, it is less likely that a new teacher will have had formal instruction in accentuation and syllabification if they learned Latin in high school using a reading based text like the Cambridge Latin Course (which I do love) because it does not include a pronunciation guide. From this point, as I've stated elsewhere, the discussion begins to go round and round on who to blame--that is, who should have taught pronunciation (high school teacher/first teacher) or who should have polished pronunciation (professors/person in charge of methods of teaching Latin course)? And that's all mute. Finger pointing never got anything done.

In 2005 I even had proposed initially via the CAMWS Newsletter something called "Fluent Latin 101". The title of the article was "Teacher Prep: New Ideas, New Approach" (page 9). This was way before the Comprehensible Input surge in Latin circles, but at a time when I was really frustrated by the lack of quality pronunciation among fellow teachers at Certamen events. I was also trying to address in the article issues that some teachers had brought up about not having studied AP authors during their undergraduate career and thus not being properly prepared to teach.  But that's another story. I published this article in the CAMWS Newsletter because I was hoping to reach the professors who could have some influence on addressing these problems which future teachers faced. Naturally it fell on deaf ears.

Last year I discovered on a blog post entitled Driving with Dido on the Indwelling Language blog. It is mainly a post--and a good one--on reading extensively in Latin, and how the author, Justin Sloacum Bailey, went on a quest to develop fluency in Latin, even though he began with a grammar first text book (Wheelock's). Anyway, at some point in the post, he gives a list of things to help with fluency, and one of them is to "record yourself reading Latin and listen to your recordings in the car, while doing chores, while shopping, etc."

This has stuck with me even though admittedly I have yet to do it. The idea was to record yourself reading a passage that you have interpreted/translated so you know what it's about, and then work on developing your own listening skills.  As I see it, the way to ensure this works well is to be extremely conscientious about your pronunciation as you read that Latin. This is not only about making sure you are pronouncing long and short vowels correctly, but that you are dividing and accenting words correctly. You are creating your source of INPUT. That is the key.

To develop your sense of quality pronunciation you need lots of INPUT, but if you aren't around speakers of Latin, you don't get the input you need. In addition, if your own teacher/instructor was apathetic with regards to the pronunciation of Latin, you need enough quality input to unteach incorrect pronunciation.

So... I guess the first thing you need to do is to decide that you need to improve your pronunciation if you know you need to. If you cannot write sentences/vocabulary from the textbook you use (assuming you are using a textbook) complete with macrons without double checking 98% of the time, then you probably need to work on pronunciation. Because, really, what we are talking about is not "pronunciation" but whether you have internalized the SOUND of the words, whether you truly OWN the words.

Why is this so important? If you are going to be telling stories orally, you have to OWN your own Latin. And if you want your students to pick up their pronunciation mainly through input, your OUTPUT must be excellent.

OK, so now maybe you realize you need to "learn" your macrons.  Really, you are working on "owning" your Latin vocab by SOUND because the macrons merely represent sounds. First make sure you know your basic rules of dividing and accenting words (see the front of a Latin dictionary or my pronunciation guide for CLC), and then practicing dividing and accenting words that are three syllables or more, followed by saying those words aloud several times. You may find words you thought you knew are really pronounced differently. You may discover you are sloppy with o's and i's. You may discover which words are mispronounced due to related words in English. (Off the top of my head, novem, 9, is a SHORT o, not a long o like in November; toga is a short o as well, not long as it is in English.)

Once you feel like you can divide and accent anything, find a passage you like (could be from your textbook series or AP or whatever), divide & accent all the words in it just to make sure you really are saying all of the words correctly, and then record yourself reading it. Now put away the text away and get a clean sheet of paper. Use your recording for dictation and see whether you can write exactly what you read previously--macrons and all. If your pronunciation is clear and accurate, you should have little problem doing this. TRUST the sound that you hear. If you hear long, write it that way. Likewise, think about where the accent is on the word; sometimes that can help you with a short a versus a long a. Practice this a bit.

Now, try finding something that does NOT have macrons. If you were to trust your "ear", could you add macrons to most of the words? Try it to see. Do any of the missed macrons change the placement of the accent on the word? Or does where you KNOW the accent of the word goes help you with deciding whether you have a long or short vowel? I know, for instance, that I pronounce "they heard" as au-di-VE-runt, so that e has to be long.

The truth is that there is no magic fix. You have to work at it. You have to realize the importance not just to your own learning but to that of your students. You have to see the bigger picture of language acquisition. And you will find that the more you work at it, the more you realize you do know, and the easier it becomes. But it all starts with you having a crystal clear idea of pronunciation.

I often think about Spanish students who will complain that one of the Spanish teachers has lousy pronunciation. Students notice.  Students care.  Students will think less of you and your expertise if they see this deficiency. Your colleagues will think less of your expertise as well. (Yes, I have thought less of professors and teachers....)  And maybe that seems arrogant... But I'm also going to pick the Shakespeare instructor who tries to do restored pronunciation over the one that recites with a heavy Texan accent.

And finally, I do believe we need to teach our students the rules for dividing and accenting words. I've always made it extra credit on one of the types of quizzes I've used in the past. I reiterate the importance of knowing the rules so you can decide how a new word sounds without my being there, but I do not punish students for having difficulties with the concept. I do grade oral recitations which we practices because that is based on hearing/speaking and not artificial rules of dividing and accenting. Nevertheless, I want my students to be armed to read extensively, and to hear the Latin in their heads or to be able to say it aloud.

It's about the input. I can provide a lot of it, but some of it will need to be experienced on their own--and I just want it to be the best experience possible.

Assessment

Sep. 24th, 2009 06:21 pm
ginlindzey: At ACL (Default)
I'm on Facebook these days (Magistra Ginny Lindzey) and if nothing else, students, parents, friends and colleagues are seeing how hard I work. Ok, admittedly that's a bit narcissistic to say (as if  I need some sort of recognition or approval), but I guess there are times that teachers are trash-talked so much I *do* want recognition for how hard I work.  Because I know I work too hard... it's obsessive, in a way, and I cannot help myself. <sigh>

So let's talk about some of my obsessiveness.

The first thing I do that I know a lot of other teachers don't do is have written portions on my tests.  Most teachers just make total multiple choice tests these days.  And I don't blame them. I spent two nights working on Latin 1 tests, and that was the first "easy" test, though clearly I have a lot of strugglers this year.  I'll just have to work with them somehow.  But here's how my tests are structured, and I'm sure I've talked about this in previous years.  (I guess I'm just trying to justify what I do an convince myself that it's worth all the grading--and I'm personally sure it is, but I'm tired too!!!)

My tests are broken up this way:

I. Reading Comprehension questions of an unseen story.  (Many written or adapted by myself.  I love writing funny stories about the characters in CLC.)  The questions are both in Latin and English, and I demand specific answers. That is, for UBI it must be the complete prepositional phrase (in triclinio, for example).  And I'm training them to not give any extra information so I can see that they truly understand the question and are not just guessing at what sentence it comes from.

II. General grammar questions (multiple choice) on items from the story.

III.  Spot translation from stories we've read in the book.  These are snippets of 3 or 4 stories and I let them choose which one.  For instance, on the stage 1-2 test, I had a snippet from Cerberus, one from Mercator, and one from In Triclinio.  About 20 words for each of them.  I count this to be the equivalent of 5 questions.  What's interesting about this is that students often think they are picking the easier story when they aren't. 

IV. Targetted grammar drills on whatever is the new grammar in the chapter.  Multiple choice.  (I have quia.com drills to preview the information and help reinforce the details I'm after.)

V. Culture. (Multiple choice)  I keep this section small, but I think it is important to include culture on the tests.  On this test, for instance, there was a map of the house and information about Caecilius's typical day. This information is also previewed in quia.com, targeting information I think is important.

So, what's good about the way I test?  I can tell you what's bad--takes a long time to grade!!

But what's good is this:

I. Reading Comprehension: I can see if they are tracking a new story accurately, and if they understand how the questions can guide them through a story, etc.  It is application of learned information, but not relying on a cold translation.  Just comprehension.

II. General Grammar: I can see if they are keeping up with their comprehension of grammar--for instance, in later tests there will be tense and case questions, etc, as we keep adding information.  It also shows me if they take the time to check the word in question in the context of the sentence or allows me to teach them the importance of checking the word in the context of a sentence (that words do not just exist in isolation, so to speak).

III. Translation of known passages: part of this is to see whether they can translate fluently and accurately.  I'm also trying to teach them and reinforce the importance of rereading stories.  Plus a lot of students can recognize the correct answer in multiple choice; at some point I need to see what they can do totally on their own.

IV. Targetted grammar with quia.com support:  although questions are generally previewed via quia.com, this can still be a tricky section for students. And often it is when students are doing the quia that I am able to walk up behind, figure out where the student is going wrong and give them one-on-one feedback besides the feedback from the computer.  Sometimes this is exactly when the information clicks for students too.

V. Culture.  Well, there are probably better ways to emphasize culture. I just don't want a test without culture because it is so important in understanding how the Romans thought. 

Anyway.

I also think that if I don't start getting them to do questions and write out translations on tests now, how can I possibly prepare them for the likes of the AP exam?  I mean, if everything is multiple choice up until that time, how is a student prepared for that??

MY QUIZZES....

Mainly vocab, always in context, but also includes a little target declining and conjugating.  Total quia preparation to see/understand what I'm targetting and why.  My good students really understand why I do things the way I do, and do internalize the details.  And as the level of Latin increases, so do the amount of words for each blank. That is, I require whole phrases to be defined--chunking.  Yeah, it ends up being like chunking so that when I explain that the Vergil translations are graded via chunking, they have no problem with it.  It's how the vocab quizzes have been all along.

And this year I'm adding back....

ORAL RECITATIONS.

This is so simple and so worthwhile.  I just have a couple of sentences or so pretyped from the first story of each stage.  We practice saying it in class together and then I go around and just have them read it to me.  I grade it on a rubric, and it makes them work a tiny bit harder on pronunciation.  I heard a lot of good Latin today... I was really pleased.

Anyway, this all takes so much time and work to do right.  But I want to make sure that each successive group of students I graduate is better prepared than the last.  I have to teach them better, somehow, and make them more able to be successful in future Latin courses.

Ok, part of me just doesn't want them to seem ill-prepared for future Latin courses.  I don't think my first group of graduates from Dripping were as well equipped as I would have liked.  So each year I try to figure out how to produce a better prepared student.  This year I'm using the fact that my Latin 3 class is pre-AP to torture them with drill and kill conjugating and declining, and in some ways I'm glad I waited to pile on this stuff until they were juniors and seniors--so much more mature, and so much more appreciative of WHY I'm making them do it.

Right.  I need to get back to grading.  I guess I just needed to justify what I do.  Remind myself that I am not just being obsessive. 

One thing I feel I am doing right is trying at all times to take into consideration what will happen to the student AFTER he/she leaves my classroom, whether he/she goes on to another teacher or on to college.  I'm not just preparing them to pass AP; I'm trying to prepare them to be SOLID READERS (*not* decoders!) of Latin so that they can succeed in any Latin class that comes in front of them. 

<sigh>

I'm in the process of working out some kinks in what I want to do for oral recitation in my AP Vergil class.  I thought I'd do some thinking out loud, so to speak.  Writing out what I want to do helps me, and perhaps following my train of thought will help some of you--or you can suggest where you think my thinking is faulty.

At the moment I have written into the syllabus that students will be doing oral recitations two times each 9 week period (4 a semester, 8 a year).  I personally believe that learning how read whole PASSAGES well out loud is important.  The Romans never read silently.  This literature was meant to be heard.  And I also think it aides in developing a more natural sense and appreciation of the Latin language.  And...well...I just feel it's the right thing to do.  Whatever.

Soooo....

I have the first passage I want to use picked out from 1.36-49

cum Iūnō, aeternum servāns sub pectore vulnus,
haec sēcum: “Mēne inceptō dēsistere victam
nec posse Ītaliā Teucrōrum āvertere rēgem—
quippe vetor fātīs! Pallasne exūrere classem
Argīvum atque ipsōs potuit summergere pontō
ūnius ob noxam et furiās Aiācis Oīleī?
Ipsa, Iovis rapidum iaculāta ē nūbibus ignem,
disiēcitque ratēs ēvertitque aequora ventīs,
illum expīrantem trānsfīxō pectore flammās
turbine corripuit scopulōque īnfīxit acūtō;
ast ego, quae dīvum incēdō rēgīna Iovisque
et soror et coniūnx, ūnā cum gente tot annōs
bella gerō. Et quisquam nūmen Iūnōnis adōrat
praetereā aut supplex ārīs impōnet honorem?”

The question is, HOW do I want to grade this?  In fact, what IS my ultimate goal?

Well, first I went to http://www.txclassics.org/OralExam.pdf for the "Oral Skills and Reading Proficiency in the Latin Curriculum: Plan of Oral Exam for Certifying Latin Teachers."    This document was written in the late 1980s to go with the ExCET test for Latin because at the time we had been told that there was going to be an oral component.  I personally think it is a very practical approach to what you need to be a Latin teacher.  It doesn't include conversational stuff which freaks everyone out.

Anyway, I'm not sure I like the rubric that's on the above PDF file.  Here is what's on the PDF with regards to grading the recitation:

****
Oral Reading – Poetry. Points will be given as follows:
Communicative Competense (Phrasing and Expression)    0 30 45 60
Mechanics of Pronunciation
      Vowel quality and quantity
      Consonant quality
      Word Accent/Rhythm & meter                                               40 points total
 
For any word with one or more errors in vowel quality, consonant quality, or rhythm and
meter, ½ point will be deducted from the 40 point total.
 
For repeated, specific errors, such as:
      failure to pronounce double consonants
      mispronunciation of “r” or of “gn”
      repeated mispronunciation of a single word (such as anglicizing Hercules or mangling spelunca)
      incorrect word accent on imperfect tense verbs (e.g. ha΄bēbat rather than habē΄bat)
      failure to elide (poetry only)
a maximum of 1 point total will be deducted, regardless of how many times a specific error is
repeated. Note: Whether to count an error in a word as one of a set of repeated, specific errors
or as an isolated error will be within the discretion of the graders of the exam.
****

Ok, so let's examine what's here because maybe it is usable.   This rubric is saying that the overall reading--expressiveness and interpretation is more important than nitpicky perfection in pronunciation.  I can appreciate that, even for all the importance I put on pronunciation.  I'd rather an expressive reading than one that has perfect pronunciation but is robotic and dull.  The choice for points awarded--0, 30, 45, 60--seems limited.  I wouldn't want to penalize a student by 15 points!  I doubt my students will be as dramatic as I am and I think there needs to be clarification here.

For instance, we could break this down to at least two things--phrasing and interpretation.  I think phrasing is so important and that a person could have excellent phrasing, demonstrating a comprehension of the passage, but a flat and unexpressive reading.  I guess the next question for me would be how should these things be weighted.  Perhaps 40/20?   The nice thing about that is that students would feel that less of this is subjective.  After all, phrasing you can identify either by punctuation or word order.  There's a concrete aspect to this.  Expression is a bit more subjective.

Ok, so 40 points for phrasing.  But how will the points be awarded or deducted?  The mechanics of pronunciation, etc, are using .5 pt per mistake--but then, that includes accent and meter too.  That's up to 80 things that could be counted wrong--and considering the passages are suggested to be 80-100 words long, it is actually possible to get a zero.  HIGHLY UNLIKELY but possible.  What about 3 pts for phrasing mistakes?  Too much?  There are 15 lines in the above passage which, times 3, would give us 45... more than the 40 points.  And I guess I'm assuming that it's unlikely that there would be more than 1 phrasing mistake per line.  Maybe I should consider the possibility of 2 phrasing mistakes per line, thus 30 items...maybe 1.5 pts per mistake?  That would equal 45 pts.  Well, maybe phrasing SHOULD be 45 and expression 15.  It can be the icing on the cake.

So, how to score the expression portion...  
0 = you suck and I'm not even sure you're alive
3 = thanks for trying, I just barely notice that you expressed feeling with a couple of obvious words
6 = you have some expression, but it's not like you care enough
9 = good, I think there's an actor in there somewhere, but you're still worried about what others are thinking
12=very good but you could reach for the gold if let go
15=extraordinary, you should be famous

Ok, that's a little cocky.  But technically it's just a 5 pt scale from good to bad.  (Plus the zero thrown in.)

But that could work, right?

Phrasing = 45
Expression/Interpretation = 15
Mechanics = 40

Hmmmm....

I think that might work.

NOW, the other thing....  I'm thinking for the 1st semester I'll let the students read off of a sheet with macrons but NOT in the 2nd semester.  Why?  To demonstrate to students that by making a healthy habit all year long of reading out loud that you can read without macrons as you internally assimilate the Vergilian vocabulary.  This should actually develop confidence in facing the AP test without macrons.

So I was thinking maybe during the 1st 9 weeks I'd let them do their two readings using their own sheets with macrons and any other things they want to write on it--meter, phrasing, accent marks, ANYTHING.

2nd 9 weeks on the day of the recitation I'd give them a clean sheet with macrons and I'd give them a few minutes (maybe up to 5) to mark anything they want to on it before reciting, though they can use NO NOTES OR BOOKS.  Kind of like a test.

3rd 9 weeks on the day of the recitation I'd give them a clean sheet WITHOUT MACRONS and the rest like the 2nd 9 weeks.

4th 9 weeks I would not tell them what the passage was going to be (while with the previous 3 nine weeks I would give them the specific passage in advance) but simply tell them it will be from the last 2 or 3 weeks of their readings.  On the day of the recitation I'd give them a clean sheet without macrons (like above).

Oh.... I just realized I've got this written down by 9 week grading periods whereas the AP test comes earlier.... well, I'll just refine this to match my syllabus, which I don't have out in front of me.

Right.  I've rambled enough about this.  Time to figure out how to write this up for the students.  Then I really need to get onto some review materials for the OTHER classes for the first week of school.

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